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Goku Vs Superman Vs Naruto Vs Ichigo Vs Luffy Vs HST Vs Dragon Ball Z Vs Bleach x One Piece V Toriko

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[Reply] #1
06-11-2013 01:55 PM
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Megatron
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Character Profiles


Introduction: Per proxy, Cloud is equal to Sephiroth.


Stats:

Willpower (the primary determinant of his stats and the power of his abilities): Multiversal (Sephiroth’s FF7 “Super Nova” ability unfolds a universe and Cloud is equal to AC Sephiroth, who’s easily many times stronger than Kadaj, who’s no weaker than his FF7 self):

Carefully watch the end of the final battle between Cloud and Kadaj. The difference in (will)power between the two is at least like that between a normal human and a speeding car/truck, namely 2-3 orders of magnitude (mind that a single slash of the original Omnislash is stronger than Finishing Touch). Now I’m not sure if Kadaj has even 1% of AC Sephiroth’s (will)power.

Strength/attack potency: Potentially up to multiversal (see above).

Range: Extended melee range with a sword, potential up to multiversal with magic.

Speed: Immeasurable/incomprehensible (AC Sephiroth transcends teleportation; even slower guys are so fast they can be in several places at once).

Durability: Potentially up to multiversal (see the “Willpower” section above)

Stamina: Very high - fights AC Sephiroth for 12h.

Standard Equipment: Fusion Swords.

Intelligence: Skilled combatant.

Weaknesses: Finite stamina.


Notable Attacks/Techniques:

- Omnislash V6 - a powerful spiritual attack with which Cloud speedblitzes Sephiroth and shatters his soul.

- Incredible willpower: Can resist Sephiroth’s telekinesis.

- Master swordsmanship




Introduction: Soon after FF7 was released in 1997, Sephiroth’s “Super Nova” attack was retconned into it’s present form. The retcon was later confirmed in Crisis Core, where SN was called his ultimate attack (see the “Supernova” section). The biggest difference it makes, save for a massive power boost, is that he apparently no longer needs the Black Materia to summon Meteor.


Stats:

Willpower (the primary determinant of his stats and the power of his abilities): Multiversal (his FF7 “Super Nova” ability unfolds a universe and, as Cloud’s equal, he’s easily many times stronger than Kadaj, who’s no weaker than his FF7 self):

Carefully watch the end of the final battle between Cloud and Kadaj. The difference in (will)power between the two is at least like that between a normal human and a speeding car/truck, namely 2-3 orders of magnitude (mind that a single slash of the original Omnislash is stronger than Finishing Touch). Now I’m not sure if Kadaj has even 1% of AC Sephiroth’s (will)power

Strength/attack potency: Potentially up to multiversal (see above).

Range: Extended melee range with a sword, up to multiversal with magic and telekinesis (see the “Super Nova” section).

Speed: Immeasurable/incomprehensible (transcends teleportation; even slower guys are so fast they can be in several places at once).

Durability: Potentially up to multiversal (see the “Willpower” section above)

Stamina: Infinite - he doesn’t tire due to his alien physiology.

Standard Equipment: Masamune.

Intelligence: Skilled combatant, master manipulator, was a general, has thousands of years of knowledge from absorbing the memories of the Lifestream.

Weaknesses: Arrogance


Notable Attacks/Techniques:

- Super Nova (Only for reference! The attack itself is NOT present in Advent Children!) - Sephiroth’s former ultimate attack (limit break?). He creates a universe*, finds a meteor, far beyond The Milky Way, and drives it into The Sun with his telekinesis.

* In The Compilation of FF7 there’s no mention of any (pre)existing parallel dimensions/universes. As demonstrated by Bahamut Sin, even the summons themselves don’t preexist and instead materialize from the Lifestream, when called forth. However, Sephiroth has no control over the LS before AC.



1)

Crisis Core wrote:
http://youtu.be/I_AcCCV5oWA?t=25m25s


- What is Sephiroth’s ultimate attack?

- Super Nova



2) Gidebook entry 1


3) Gidebook entry 2


4) Guidebook entry 3:

Crisis Core Complete Guide wrote: Super Nova

In FFVII it is the strongest technique that Safer Sephiroth uses, destroying planets with the power of an expanding sun, the resulting supernova obliterating his enemies. Within Crisis Core, it is one of the answers required to pass the Premium Fanclub’s test.


Source: The Lifestream.net


5) Dissidia appearance:



6)

Final Fantasy AlltThe Bravest wrote:
Safer Sephiroth

Though able to command supernovas, this guy can’t even spell his own name.



- Incredible willpower/telekinesis: See above. He can also pull himself out of the Lifestream and turn FF7 Earth into his spaceship.

- Master swordsmanship

- Meteor: A scaled-down version of Super Nova (the Black Materia is seemingly nothing more than a plot device.

- Flight: A very generic flight ability


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Man wields his sword to die with a smile on his face on a distant day beyond his dreams.

Edited 11-23-2014 06:14 PM by Megatron
[Reply] #2
06-11-2013 01:56 PM
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Izayoi
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Bahamut Zero > Cloud. See you later.


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[Reply] #3
06-11-2013 01:57 PM
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nWo
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Solar system buster = Cloud

[Reply] #4
06-11-2013 03:59 PM
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Kuja
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Lol all that is wrong.

[Reply] #5
06-11-2013 05:01 PM
aergar5has
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At least make it all of FF.

[Reply] #6
06-11-2013 05:11 PM
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Ke Ke
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Kuja9001 wrote: Lol all that is wrong.



Megatron just got shut down. HARD.

Edited 06-11-2013 05:11 PM by Ke Ke
[Reply] #7
06-15-2013 10:36 PM
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???


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[Reply] #8
06-15-2013 11:30 PM
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Wade
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If Cloud casts “Stop” in reverse, he could easily beat Superman’s Time Reverse.

"!potS”

[Reply] #9
06-15-2013 11:31 PM
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Izayoi
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BTW. KHDDD >>> FF7. Prove me wrong.


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[Reply] #10
06-16-2013 12:12 AM
The Fixer
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ZeedMillenniummon Fancy Mode wrote: BTW. KHI >>> FF7. Prove me wrong.

Fix’d

[Reply] #11
06-16-2013 03:31 AM
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Kurosaki
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Good thread....

Btw I still believe they are nowhere close to solar system/supernova level.

Because fodder like Loz and Yazoo being able to keep up with Base Cloud, who you believe has Supernova level durability. Now do you even believe Loz to be near Supernova level in strength?

And the KE equation is not always valid, its the pressure created by their swings that causes the destruction (not energy). OBD has mach 50 = country level DC


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[Reply] #12
06-16-2013 03:32 AM
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Lol.


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[Reply] #13
06-16-2013 09:03 AM
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Megatron
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Bringer Light wrote: Good thread....

Btw I still believe they are nowhere close to solar system/supernova level.

Because fodder like Loz and Yazoo being able to keep up with Base Cloud, who you believe has Supernova level durability. Now do you even believe Loz to be near Supernova level in strength?


Kadaj is that strong, that’s sure. The level of power of the remaining two is somewhat a mystery, so it’s hard to say whether they are weaker or equal to him. Considering they can can keep up with Cloud, I would say they can’t be too far behind. You surely can’t say Cloud isn’t supernova-level because he gets tagged by two guys of unknown strength.


Bringer Light wrote:
And the KE equation is not always valid, its the pressure created by their swings that causes the destruction (not energy). OBD has mach 50 = country level DC


Attack potency is basically focused energy, which doesn’t escape to produce collateral damage, because authors say so. For instance, on one instance pissed-off Eternity went all-out and busted a planet where Thanos was hiding, without causing unoverse-wide destruction.

I probably know how they got this mach 50 - by calculating the fraction of the power absorbed by a human fro m a country-level blast - but I don’t find such interpretation plausible. To me, when an author says “supernova”, they mean “entire supernova”, or 10^44/10^45J, not something like “0,0000000000000000000000000073 of a supernova”, or ~200Mt. I have serious reasons to doubt most authors would agree with them on it.


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Man wields his sword to die with a smile on his face on a distant day beyond his dreams.

Edited 06-16-2013 09:04 AM by Megatron
[Reply] #14
06-16-2013 09:29 AM
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Wade
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Bringer Light wrote:
And the KE equation is not always valid, its the pressure created by their swings that causes the destruction (not energy). OBD has mach 50 = country level DC



While his kinetic energy calculation is wrong and ridiculous, it is in fact kinetic energy which does damage in classical physics for sub-sonic and faster collisions.

A blunt object, such as a chain, can do just as much, if not more damage, than a sword when swung at near-sonic speeds, so the shape of the blade doesn’t make much difference in total damage, though it will change the type of damage in some cases.

Arguably, the total damage may even go down with a blade, because it can slice clean through, which is actually a waste of energy as a weapon. You actually want all of the energy to be distributed into the target for an ideal weapon. However, in some cases that doesn’t matter, such as decapitation or cutting someone in half.

Mythbusters Chain in a Cannon test:



The Chain proved to be the most destructive ammo, beating out the actual canon ball, grapeshot, knives, glass, and other choices. though it would likely be much less effective at maximum range for the canon ball, because of extra surface area increasing drag.

The muzzle velocity of the chain is about mach 1.2.

In Advent Children, Cloud and Sephiroth’s sword swings clearly do far more damage than a close range cannon shot, as they topple the walls of large buildings with each swing. However, they are by no means doing supernova class damage with any of their attacks.

An impact at Solar System velocities, such as 17km/s for an asteroid, produces partial disintegration of a Silicon glass target.

In this case, the target is a metal plate, and you can observe how the crater is formed as the metal is liquified on impact and then solidifies into the ridging, partially ejected from the crater.



Based on denting in the structure when in the “Cloud vs Angeal and Genesis” video, it is likely that their swings were slower than 17km/s, because when they block it does pit the structure, but does not carry through to disintegration. Sephiroth’s cutting of the gun would require that the Masamune either has mystical properties (highly likely.) or that it would be like one molecule thick in order to cut that finely.



So, I would conclude that the evidence suggest their sword swings are roughly Asteroid impact speed, but probably slightly slower.

In Mach numbers, this is Mach 51.

If the sword is 5kg, then you can calculate a portion of the kinetic energy using 17km/s, but you also have to figure that a full power sword stroke also involves the mass of your own arms and upper body, and in some cases may involve the entire body mass. For simplicity, I will ignore the wielder’s body mass component, since that would be different for every stroke.

Ek = (1/2)mv^2 = 722,500,000Joules

This is about 164 kilograms of TNT equivalent, which, if you look at implosion videos from demolition teams, I’d say that’s pretty reasonable for finding about the right range of attack power.

However, in many cases they make many swings per second, which is easily possible if the weapon velocity is in fact that high.


Ironically, the thunderstorm Sephiroth made in the movie, which did nothing, except add a visual effect, would be far more powerful than any of the physical attacks they made in the movie.

Edited 06-16-2013 09:30 AM by Wade
[Reply] #15
06-16-2013 10:04 AM
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When you get shutdown by Wade, you should just give up. Good job btw.

[Reply] #16
06-16-2013 11:35 AM
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Megatron
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Wade wrote:
[...]


Kuja9001 wrote: When you get shutdown by Wade, you should just give up. Good job btw.


...ignoring all the feats, as well as the fact that fiction doesn’t overly care of collateral damage, and giving a lot of hardly relevant info.


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Man wields his sword to die with a smile on his face on a distant day beyond his dreams.

Edited 06-17-2013 04:02 AM by Megatron
[Reply] #17
06-16-2013 12:54 PM
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Megatron wrote:
Kadaj is that strong, that’s sure. The level of power of the remaining two is somewhat a mystery, so it’s hard to say whether they are weaker or equal to him. Considering they can can keep up with Cloud, I would say they can’t be too far behind. You surely can’t say Cloud isn’t supernova-level because he gets tagged by two guys of unknown strength.

Even Tifa could keep up with Loz and she survived the fight with him.

Now if you believe Loz isn’t that much behind Cloud, do you believe even Tifa is near Supernova level?



Attack potency is basically focused energy, which doesn’t escape to produce collateral damage, because authors say so. For instance, on one instance pissed-off Eternity went all-out and busted a planet where Thanos was hiding, without causing unoverse-wide destruction.

I probably know how they got this mach 50 - by calculating the fraction of the power absorbed by a human fro m a country-level blast - but I don’t find such interpretation plausible.

No, its not the fraction of power absorbed by a human, rather its because of the pressure released from their swings.
Even slow swings release massive amounts of pressure, which causes huge destruction

Look at this calc, this guy is a high tier from YYH with country level DC. Yet his swing is calced to be only mach 50
http://www.narutoforums.com/blog.php?b=16134


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Edited 06-16-2013 12:54 PM by Kurosaki
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06-16-2013 02:31 PM
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Megatron
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Loz is basically toying with Tifa. When gets more serious, it’s over at once: www.youtube.com/watch?v=OZdfqsHz91I


Regarding the calc, the same problem as always: http://loungevswiki.wikispaces.com/search/view/calcs. In short, things like this are NOT scaled.

The only reason why scaling the world map of FF7 works at all is because we know the size of the planet and, despite being a sphere, it behaves more like a flat surface: http://youtu.be/W4_sw0trdNc?t=5m16s Normally, seeing Meteor from Cosmo Canyon would have been totally impossible, due to the planet’s curvature.


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Man wields his sword to die with a smile on his face on a distant day beyond his dreams.

Edited 06-16-2013 02:32 PM by Megatron
[Reply] #19
06-16-2013 03:26 PM
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Country+ level striking force and durability.



(Cloud surviving a blast that destroyed the northern continent and made a hole to the core of the planet)

Casual lightning timers (mach 300+)


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Just...what...was that?

[Reply] #20
06-16-2013 04:49 PM
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Izayoi
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Fortinbross wrote: Country+ level striking force and durability.



(Cloud surviving a blast that destroyed the northern continent and made a hole to the core of the planet)

Casual lightning timers (mach 300+)



Country Cloud is more accurate IMO.


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