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Bleach Vs Discussion Thread: Power, Strengths, Abilities etc.

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[Reply] #821
09-16-2013 07:23 PM
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The Alchemist wrote:

Tornado The Dragon - a.k.a Big Brother wrote:
If you want me to do all of these just send me the scans (mangafox preferably or mangastream). But I will be doing Yamamoto last just to let you know.




1) And apparently it takes about 540 kilo calories to vaporise 1kg (or 1 litre) of water.



So you want me to calculate how much energy does it take to vaporize an x amount of water correct? So first just estimate the amount of water vaped (evaporation). Then energy needed to make 1L of water reach 100 degrees celsius in 1 second; and multiply by the estimated amount I guess.

1) I’ll see that to myself BL mate.

Is that it or something more?


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[Reply] #822
09-17-2013 05:24 AM
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Tornado The Dragon - a.k.a Big Brother wrote:

The Alchemist wrote:

Tornado The Dragon - a.k.a Big Brother wrote:
If you want me to do all of these just send me the scans (mangafox preferably or mangastream). But I will be doing Yamamoto last just to let you know.




1) And apparently it takes about 540 kilo calories to vaporise 1kg (or 1 litre) of water.



So you want me to calculate how much energy does it take to vaporize an x amount of water correct? So first just estimate the amount of water vaped (evaporation). Then energy needed to make 1L of water reach 100 degrees celsius in 1 second; and multiply by the estimated amount I guess.

1) I’ll see that to myself BL mate.

Is that it or something more?

Yep. And also the energy required to vape 1L of water, multiplied by the number of liters in that sea.


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[Reply] #823
09-17-2013 12:10 PM
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Requested by:Lightning Blade/Bringer Light/The Alchemist
Calculated by: ~Tornado The Dragon - a.k.a Big Brother~
Link to calc:http://lounge.moviecodec.com/vs-general/bleach-discussion-about-how-powerful-they-are-reasons-etc-181013/42
post #: 835

This calculation deals with Ichigo releasing his new zanpkatou and how much energy was outputted. The scans are under the spoiler labelled “Method 2” from chapter 542 courtesy of Mangafox.

so the specific heat capacity of water in liquid is: 4.18 j/g and in gas: 2.02 j.g and since the water evaporated by Ichigo went from being a liquid to a gas(steam) I will just be using the average for this (and yes I know it is not so simple for those of you who have taken chemistry. Just chill out being very loose here).

So Cp= (4.18+2.02)^1/2 (since energy is lost exponentially in an open system)= 2.4899799195977464749671941333564 j/g= 2.5 J/g (apx.)



The delta T is 100-20 (assuming room temperature but it should be hotter in a furnace room)= 80 degrees Celsius.



Now we need to find the mass. In order to do that we first need to estimate how many liters can be in a 1) a sea 2) how much it appears in the scan since the sea part could be a hyperbole. Unless there is some more solid evidence suggesting it was an actual sea.

The smallest one I could find was the Baltic sea. Its dimensions are:

depth/height= 55 m the area with (lxw like for land surface area) is: 422,200 (km)^2= 4.22x10^8 m^2

So the volume in meters is area x d= 23,210,000,000 m^3

The density of water is: 1,000.00 kg/m³

and m=d*v= 1,000.00 kg/m³*23,210,000,000 m^3= 23,210,000,000,000 kg= 23.21 trillion kilograms.

Assuming the water reached a v=1 m/s and a=1 m/s^2 (very low balled I know)

Then the force behind such a casual release using f=ma (for those with a more appropriate equation for this let me know but for a value such as this I think it should be fine but the relativistic force equation may apply to this I can check later).

F= 23,210,000,000,000 kg*1 m/s^2= 23.21 trillion newtons.
p=mv= 23.21 trillion kg*m/s^2

(but looking it at it now these are a bit higher then usual so Newtonian-esque equations are probably giving a higher value than it actually is. So you can still drop it by a factor of a 100 or thousand. Still mighty mighty impressive for a hst character just with a release of their zanpkatou I might add!)

So going by the image provided H=Cp*delta T*m= 2.5 J/g*80 degrees Celsius*23,210,000,000,000 kg=4,642,000,000,000,000 J= 4.642 x 10^15 J via just by releasing.

To get an idea this is equivalent to destroying a city just by releasing his zanpaktou.





Its a full sphere going by on page 11:



wikipedia wrote: Tojinbo, Sakai, Fukui prefecture, Japan 25 m above Sea of Japan



So with the height being 25 m and taking that as the depth for the 'sea'. Now going by this image:

There are others out there and if someone has a better or a more legit source let me know thanks.

The radius seems like it could be from 30 to 45 meters. So I will go with 30 m.

So the volume of a sphere is v=4/3*pi*r^3 were pi=3.14 (apx.)

v= 4/3*3.14*(30)^3= 113,097.33552923255658465516179806 m^3

m=d*v= 1000 kg/m^3* 113,097.33552923255658465516179806 m^3
m=113097335.52923255658465516179806 kg
m= 113,097,335.53 (apx.) kg

So H= 2.5*80*113,097,335.53=22,619,467,105.846511316931032359612 J= 22,619,467,105.85 J (apx.)=2.262x10^10 J





Thanks Lightning Blade/Bringer Light/The Alchemist for the advice and friendly critique.




By Method 1:
Ichigo has AP/DC of city just by releasing his zanpaktou & his aoe is several thousand KM.

By Method 2:
Ichigo has AP/DC of a town and a range of only a few KM at best.


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Edited 09-17-2013 01:57 PM by Tornado The Dragon - a.k.a Big Brother
[Reply] #824
09-17-2013 12:13 PM
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Method 2 is no better than pixel scaling. Infact even worse I guess, since you’ve randomly assumed the values...


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Edited 09-17-2013 12:14 PM by Kurosaki
[Reply] #825
09-17-2013 12:17 PM
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The Alchemist wrote: Method 2 is no better than pixel scaling. Infact even worse I guess, since you’ve randomly assumed the values...



no not randomly going by how small cliffs and how big they ca be. We can use estimates for a list of world’s cliffs like I did for the baltic sea, or hills, mountains, wikipedia and many other sites (acclaimed ones too) have lists of these things measuring their dimensions, mass, volume, area, etc.

IF you want I can try and find list of cliffs and what not.


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[Reply] #826
09-17-2013 12:18 PM
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The smallest cliff height record is 25 meters so I will go with that.


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[Reply] #827
09-17-2013 12:22 PM
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Yeah that’s better. Using something as a reference is better, but we also can;t randomly assume this cliff is as large as an average one either, can we?

Btw you’ve also assumed the “sea” to be a sphere...when it should actually be a cylinder (only the cross section is circular).


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[Reply] #828
09-17-2013 12:27 PM
smarty
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smarty wrote: So... here are some speed feats.

[img]http://z.mfcdn.net/store/manga/9/18-150.0/compressed/_manga_rain_bleach_ch150_01.jpg[/img]
[img]http://z.mfcdn.net/store/manga/9/18-150.0/compressed/_manga_rain_bleach_ch150_04.jpg[/img]


[img]http://z.mfcdn.net/store/manga/9/18-153.0/compressed/_manga_rain_bleach_ch153_12.jpg[/img]
[img]http://z.mfcdn.net/store/manga/9/18-153.0/compressed/_manga_rain_bleach_ch153_13.jpg[/img]


[img]http://z.mfcdn.net/store/manga/9/18-153.0/compressed/_manga_rain_bleach_ch153_16.jpg[/img]
[img]http://z.mfcdn.net/store/manga/9/18-153.0/compressed/_manga_rain_bleach_ch153_17.jpg[/img]


[img]http://z.mfcdn.net/store/manga/9/18-154.0/compressed/_manga_rain_bleach_ch154_17.jpg[/img]
[img]http://z.mfcdn.net/store/manga/9/18-154.0/compressed/_manga_rain_bleach_ch154_18.jpg[/img]



How big is that “hill”?

^^

[Reply] #829
09-17-2013 12:30 PM
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The Alchemist wrote: Yeah that’s better. Using something as a reference is better, but we also can;t randomly assume this cliff is as large as an average one either, can we?

Btw you’ve also assumed the “sea” to be a sphere...when it should actually be a cylinder (only the cross section is circular).



True I could go by averages but getting the lowest end possible is very important that way people can’t bash you for trying to use higher values. After that if it will be more accurate we can use averages or even higher values depending on the scenario.

The sphere part is only holds true for the second part. Not for the first part. Since for method 2 I am not relying on the Baltic sea reference. And Kubo didn’t draw out the whole 'sea' so I can’t say. Just going by what was given to me.


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[Reply] #830
09-17-2013 01:04 PM
kajafamakalaka
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Tornado The Dragon - a.k.a Big Brother wrote:

The Alchemist wrote: Yeah that’s better. Using something as a reference is better, but we also can;t randomly assume this cliff is as large as an average one either, can we?

Btw you’ve also assumed the “sea” to be a sphere...when it should actually be a cylinder (only the cross section is circular).



True I could go by averages but getting the lowest end possible is very important that way people can’t bash you for trying to use higher values. After that if it will be more accurate we can use averages or even higher values depending on the scenario.

The sphere part is only holds true for the second part. Not for the first part. Since for method 2 I am not relying on the Baltic sea reference. And Kubo didn’t draw out the whole 'sea' so I can’t say. Just going by what was given to me.




So that lowest end thing is part of why u liked my FRAGGOR thing then, and hey it’s been a while.

[Reply] #831
09-17-2013 01:13 PM
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kajafamakalaka wrote:

Tornado The Dragon - a.k.a Big Brother wrote:

The Alchemist wrote: Yeah that’s better. Using something as a reference is better, but we also can;t randomly assume this cliff is as large as an average one either, can we?

Btw you’ve also assumed the “sea” to be a sphere...when it should actually be a cylinder (only the cross section is circular).



True I could go by averages but getting the lowest end possible is very important that way people can’t bash you for trying to use higher values. After that if it will be more accurate we can use averages or even higher values depending on the scenario.

The sphere part is only holds true for the second part. Not for the first part. Since for method 2 I am not relying on the Baltic sea reference. And Kubo didn’t draw out the whole 'sea' so I can’t say. Just going by what was given to me.




So that lowest end thing is part of why u liked my FRAGGOR thing then, and hey it’s been a while.



Why yes it has. And yes. If you use the lowest values and your method(s), formula(s) use of canon material is correct then people will need to change their thinking about that verse. Whether the value turns out to be much lower or higher than what people normally thought about it before.

So what’s good?

edit: BL & Ladd I’m all done it’s on the previous page my calc put it in the OP and let people critique it. If it passes the test then we should be able to use it.


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Edited 09-17-2013 01:13 PM by Tornado The Dragon - a.k.a Big Brother
[Reply] #832
09-17-2013 01:16 PM
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I’ll be working on a Speed Calculation at some point this week; maybe Thursday or Friday =/


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[Reply] #833
09-17-2013 01:19 PM
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smarty wrote:

smarty wrote: So... here are some speed feats.










How big is that “hill”?

^^

[Reply] #834
09-17-2013 01:20 PM
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smarty wrote:

smarty wrote: So... here are some speed feats.










How big is that “hill”?

^^



I will just give you my estimate for their heights by eyeballing them not saying they are correct. Take it with a grain of salt:

Image 1: 25-30 m
Image 2: 60-110 m
Going from Image 3 to Image 4 a reaction of 200-400 m/s.
Image 5 to Image 6 same thing as above.
Image 7 to Image 8 Having a “pleasant” conversation with the Head master lol!


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[Reply] #835
09-17-2013 01:21 PM
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@Ladd I’m all done it’s on the previous page my calc put it in the OP and let people critique it. If it passes the test then we should be able to use it.

post #835 I believe.


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[Reply] #836
09-17-2013 01:21 PM
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The only thing here is that is the reforged Zan; not an actual release or showing. That was just the heat needed to actual forge the blade.

So, I dunno what that means in the long run tbh.


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[Reply] #837
09-17-2013 01:21 PM
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I’ll put it up there when I get home.

I’m on mobile right now.

Edited 09-17-2013 01:22 PM by Fuck you Luis
[Reply] #838
09-17-2013 01:22 PM
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Chaos Theory wrote: The only thing here is that is the reforged Zan; not an actual release or showing. That was just the heat needed to actual forge the blade.

So, I dunno what that means in the long run tbh.



True but at the same time he did release it I think. Unless it turns out to be not even his shikai lol.

edit; if true would just make Ichigo alot stronger.

Ladd Russo wrote: I’ll put it up here when i get home.

I’m on mobile right now.



Fine fair enough.


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Edited 09-17-2013 01:23 PM by Tornado The Dragon - a.k.a Big Brother
[Reply] #839
09-17-2013 01:23 PM
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Chaos Theory wrote: The only thing here is that is the reforged Zan; not an actual release or showing. That was just the heat needed to actual forge the blade.

So, I dunno what that means in the long run tbh.

durability to the heat.

The heat which vaped the sea, didn’t do much to Ichigo’s hand


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[Reply] #840
09-17-2013 01:25 PM
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Didn’t do much to Ichigo or the other people/Zan around either so BLEACH has some high heat resistance


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