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[Reply] #41
06-20-2013 06:31 PM
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Smorg wrote:

ZeedMillenniummon Fancy Mode wrote: She isn’t scratching any of the Weapons.

I know she probably couldn’t but i don’t think they count as characters.



They have names and they move and interact with the enviornment. They are characters.


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[Reply] #42
06-20-2013 06:31 PM
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NiTian ErXing a.k.a Grand Marshal
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Nah 13-2 Lightning is above Zack and Cloud (w/o PIS). Not talking about the weapons here. Unless if you are counting Zack’s bahamut from the gameplay cutscene then yes I will agree with you Heretic.


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RyanBurnsTheHaruhiSuzumiyaFantard wrote: Prove me wrong


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[Reply] #43
06-20-2013 06:34 PM
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GohanAf24 wrote: Nah 13-2 Lightning is above Zack and Cloud (w/o PIS). Not talking about the weapons here. Unless if you are counting Zack’s bahamut from the gameplay cutscene then yes I will agree with you Heretic.



How, pray-tell, is she above Zack and Cloud? All she has is a possible durability feat against city level attacks and immunity to time control. I don’t recall anything that puts her above Vincent, much less Cloud.

But I’d be willing to listen if you’ve got a different opinion.


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[Reply] #44
06-20-2013 06:39 PM
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The Heretic wrote:

GohanAf24 wrote: Nah 13-2 Lightning is above Zack and Cloud (w/o PIS). Not talking about the weapons here. Unless if you are counting Zack’s bahamut from the gameplay cutscene then yes I will agree with you Heretic.



How, pray-tell, is she above Zack and Cloud? All she has is a possible durability feat against city level attacks and immunity to time control. I don’t recall anything that puts her above Vincent, much less Cloud.

But I’d be willing to listen if you’ve got a different opinion.



Brah I’m sure you would know the kind of momentum that comes with even small meteorites. Now think about a large meteorite a size of a house or building. Considering only a 6 mile asteroid was enough to completely change the surface of the earth for a long time not to mention the climate (wiped out the dinosaurs too). Lightning was able to stop a much smaller one which is easily far above city level.

I can bring in more RL examples of meteorite/asteroid damage if you like. But if you count the gameplay cut scenes with bahamut destroying the moon then Zack> Lightning (13-2 even). If not Then Sephiroth>Lightning. If just goingby the story, information given in the novels/books.


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RyanBurnsTheHaruhiSuzumiyaFantard wrote: Prove me wrong


They’re turned on by living things.


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[Reply] #45
06-20-2013 06:52 PM
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[Reply] #46
06-20-2013 06:53 PM
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GohanAf24 wrote:

The Heretic wrote:

GohanAf24 wrote: Nah 13-2 Lightning is above Zack and Cloud (w/o PIS). Not talking about the weapons here. Unless if you are counting Zack’s bahamut from the gameplay cutscene then yes I will agree with you Heretic.



How, pray-tell, is she above Zack and Cloud? All she has is a possible durability feat against city level attacks and immunity to time control. I don’t recall anything that puts her above Vincent, much less Cloud.

But I’d be willing to listen if you’ve got a different opinion.



Brah I’m sure you would know the kind of momentum that comes with even small meteorites. Now think about a large meteorite a size of a house or building. Considering only a 6 mile asteroid was enough to completely change the surface of the earth for a long time not to mention the climate (wiped out the dinosaurs too). Lightning was able to stop a much smaller one which is easily far above city level.

I can bring in more RL examples of meteorite/asteroid damage if you like. But if you count the gameplay cut scenes with bahamut destroying the moon then Zack> Lightning (13-2 even). If not Then Sephiroth>Lightning. If just goingby the story, information given in the novels/books.



Can you post the scene? I can’t seem to find it. But if I recall, the meteor exploded over the surface and didn’t make impact. Which would mean it wouldn’t have the complete destructive force.

You also have the issue of speed, I don’t believe it was going all that fast either.


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[Reply] #47
06-20-2013 07:35 PM
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The Heretic wrote:

GohanAf24 wrote:

The Heretic wrote:

GohanAf24 wrote: Nah 13-2 Lightning is above Zack and Cloud (w/o PIS). Not talking about the weapons here. Unless if you are counting Zack’s bahamut from the gameplay cutscene then yes I will agree with you Heretic.



How, pray-tell, is she above Zack and Cloud? All she has is a possible durability feat against city level attacks and immunity to time control. I don’t recall anything that puts her above Vincent, much less Cloud.

But I’d be willing to listen if you’ve got a different opinion.



Brah I’m sure you would know the kind of momentum that comes with even small meteorites. Now think about a large meteorite a size of a house or building. Considering only a 6 mile asteroid was enough to completely change the surface of the earth for a long time not to mention the climate (wiped out the dinosaurs too). Lightning was able to stop a much smaller one which is easily far above city level.

I can bring in more RL examples of meteorite/asteroid damage if you like. But if you count the gameplay cut scenes with bahamut destroying the moon then Zack> Lightning (13-2 even). If not Then Sephiroth>Lightning. If just goingby the story, information given in the novels/books.



Can you post the scene? I can’t seem to find it. But if I recall, the meteor exploded over the surface and didn’t make impact. Which would mean it wouldn’t have the complete destructive force.

You also have the issue of speed, I don’t believe it was going all that fast either.



@18:03-18:48

That just means she tanked most of it. And it still did plenty of damage to Valhalla. And by that reasoning we could also say ff7 lightning wasn’t like real lightning which is silly to me both ways. Just like FF7 lightning is considered to have the same properties as real lightning same goes for the mid/large meteor in 13-2.

Well it doesn’t looks as fast considering that it was being viewed from Lightning’s perspective (its still very fast). Low end: mach 32.3 high end: 205.7 Same reason as why in fiction when motion or damage being portrayed seems less or more (from RL) depending on from which character’s viewpoint the event is observed from.


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RyanBurnsTheHaruhiSuzumiyaFantard wrote: Prove me wrong


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[Reply] #48
06-20-2013 09:13 PM
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It wasn’t moving fast at all. lol

It’s not Lightning’s perspective, it’s a third person perspective. Like an invisible camera man there showing us the action. If it was Lightning’s perspective we’d be seeing through her eyes. Not seeing it from the other side of Valhalla.

The speed is where 90% of the destructive power of a meteor comes from. If it were going as fast as a normal meteorite it would have leveled Valhalla. The place is wrecked, but it doesn’t show the kind of damage that would come from an actual impact. City buster is as high as anybody would label it with the damage we see when Noel and Serah visit it.


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[Reply] #49
06-20-2013 09:20 PM
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I’d also like to point out, that it would take a meteor over 500 feet in diameter, that’s a good bit larger than your average sized house, to take out a large city area. Whereas it’s difficult to judge the size of the meteor in the video, it’s far from being a mile in diameter, which is what it would require to destroy something the size of California.


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Edited 06-20-2013 09:21 PM by The Legend
[Reply] #50
06-20-2013 09:23 PM
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The Heretic wrote: It wasn’t moving fast at all. lol



Well then it looks like we have a... DISAGREEMENT! AWWW YEAH! cool

The Heretic wrote: It’s not Lightning’s perspective, it’s a third person perspective. Like an invisible camera man there showing us the action. If it was Lightning’s perspective we’d be seeing through her eyes. Not seeing it from the other side of Valhalla.



Well you can say that as well. It went back and forth and ended up being with third person. Initially I would say Lightning’s perspective. And ofc they have to show it in a way the the player can view it as well. If it was going as fast as an actual meteorite then the gamer would not be able to see much happening since it would be way too fast. That’s why we take it from the character’s perspective (imo).

The Heretic wrote: The speed is where 90% of the destructive power of a meteor comes from.



For the most part yes. The mass is also important but since we are talking about momentum I agree.

The Heretic wrote: If it were going as fast as a normal meteorite it would have leveled Valhalla.



Then that just goes to show that Lightning tanked most of the destructive force of it. SO less environmental damage was done to Valhalla.

The Heretic wrote: The place is wrecked, but it doesn’t show the kind of damage that would come from an actual impact.



Like I said before she is clearly shown to be tanking the attack by Caius. I’m sure you know this Cid mate.

The Heretic wrote: City buster is as high as anybody would label it with the damage we see when Noel and Serah visit it.



Well if you are just simply going to judge by aoe damage which is not a good way to determine all sorts of feats. I mean by the viewpoint Saiyan characters (post namek saga) don’t have easily planet+ power.

I think you are forgetting attack potency. Which is very important in fiction. I believe you were even a part of making it mostly Wolf though if I remember right.

P.S. I’m just saying if we don’t count the gameplay cut scenes of Zack summoning Bahamut then She goes all the way to Sephiroth. If counted then I agree with you she is high tier only.

Edit:

The Heretic wrote: I’d also like to point out, that it would take a meteor over 500 feet in diameter, that’s a good bit larger than your average sized house, to take out a large city area. Whereas it’s difficult to judge the size of the meteor in the video, it’s far from being a mile in diameter, which is what it would require to destroy something the size of California.



Well I sort of addressed this earlier it would then depend on the velocity of the meteorite then. You can have two meteorites with very different masses have the same momentum. The difference would be in the speed. Since p=mv. So that’s good info at hand but it doesn’t seem to change the scenario right now.


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Pocket Rocket wrote:

RyanBurnsTheHaruhiSuzumiyaFantard wrote: Prove me wrong


They’re turned on by living things.


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Edited 06-20-2013 09:25 PM by NiTian ErXing a.k.a Grand Marshal
[Reply] #51
06-20-2013 09:28 PM
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^ The biggest problem you’ve got on your hands, is that we’re talking about something that would cause a HUGE explosion. Lightning didn’t absorb the impact. She was there, but since it was obviously an AOE attack we have to consider the damage done to the environment to determine it’s potency since we have nothing else to compare it to brah.

The attack also wasn’t meant to collide with Valhalla, it’s the same attack Caius used before where the meteor came forth and rained meteors down upon the land. That’s why Lightning says “not this again” when she goes to destroy it. The meteor from before slowly emerged from a summoning portal and stopped in the air. This meteor likely did the same thing.

Think of it like Meteor from FF7. Big, foreboding, slow as frack.


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[Reply] #52
06-20-2013 09:30 PM
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GohanAf24 wrote: Well I sort of addressed this earlier it would then depend on the velocity of the meteorite then. You can have two meteorites with very different masses have the same momentum. The difference would be in the speed. Since p=mv. So that’s good info at hand but it doesn’t seem to change the scenario right now.



You mentioned that, sure.

But from what we can see. You have a fairly large, but only city destroying meteorite that moves slow as hell.

You can definitely theorize that it was moving really fast but was slowed down for the camera. But there’s nothing to solidify that kind of thought. Only what we can see.

So Lightning can’t be officially stated to be beyond a city+ level in durability.


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[Reply] #53
06-21-2013 01:33 PM
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She beats

The Party(Tifa, Barret, & etc)
Zack
The Turks
Genesis
Angeal
The Shinra Army

[Reply] #54
06-21-2013 02:43 PM
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Zack is mach 100+
Lightning is only mach 29+


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[Reply] #55
06-21-2013 02:50 PM
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Bringer Light wrote: Zack is mach 100+
Lightning is only mach 29+



I don’t use obd numbers.

Light is better in all stats than Etro’s previous guardian Bahamut who dodged multiple “lightning spells”

[Reply] #56
06-21-2013 03:15 PM
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She could beat Marlene, but she’d never make the cut in S.O.L.D.I.E.R.

[Reply] #57
06-22-2013 10:05 AM
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Wade wrote: she’d never make the cut in S.O.L.D.I.E.R.



Based on what exactly?

[Reply] #58
06-22-2013 10:28 AM
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Wade wrote: She could beat Marlene, but she’d never make the cut in S.O.L.D.I.E.R.

Cloud without s-cells is nothing he would even be a first class if it wasn’t for that so lightning vs cloud without s-cell enhancement would get one shotted by lightning.

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